Brines 101: The differences between Gradient and Equilibrium Brines

[DiggingDogFarm]

Sorry I missed your question until now.
Up to a couple weeks or even more is fine.
I tend to inject to speed things up rather than go with a long brine time.
Cure #2 is intended for dry curing where the meat or sausage is hung to dry for an extended period of time.

HTH

 

[Walt]

Thanks.  I've used instacure #2, as per the receipe, for the 2 week dry cures on Breasola & Prosciutini.  My understanding is, injecting or useing a jaccard is not a safe practice if followed by dry ageing.  However, that would really help speed things up for a brine alone. Please correct any misunderstanding I may have.

It is outstanding having your level of knowledge on the forum.

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

Some folks do caution against injecting before dry curing but it's been common practice for a very long time and when you think about it it's no more dangerous than dry curing sausages (assuming recommended safety parameters are followed, mainly, proper levels of salt and appropriate cure)
A combination cure, a dry cure mix applied to the outside of the meat and a brine injected along the bone, has been promoted by Morton and the like for decades. The injected curing brine speeds up the overall curing and protects against bone-sour, which is serious potential problem if just a dry cure is applied.

The important thing, in terms of safety, when dry curing whole cuts or sausages for an extend period of time is the percentage of salt used.....the general consensus is that 2.5% salt is the absolute minimum required for safety.

HTH

 

[Walt]

Thanks again, Martin.

 

[pignout013]

Let me see if I have this correct .If I have 4530 g pic nik. I add my 4530 g water. Then i can add salt, sugar, and seasoning but at the end of the day th water and meat weight must be equal? Or water equal to meat and seasoning combind weight? Doing it this way how do you figure % of cure going in to a 10,15,or30%. Im a little confussed but please bare with me I will get it. thanks
  KD

 

[RG]

Use the online calculator and it should clear things up for you.

Equilibrium Brine Calculator

 

[DivotMaker]

Hi KD - welcome to the club!  I see this is your first post, so be sure to head over to the Introductions section some time, and tell us a little about yourself.

When I make an equilibrium brine, I get the amounts of salt, cure and sugar from Martin's calculator (which are based on the meat weight, and the percentage of salt and sugar desired).  Then, I measure out the dry ingredients of the brine in a pan, and add around a cup of water.  I like to heat my brine ingredients to dissolve them and blend the flavors.

After the brine is cooled, I add that to a clean container on the scale, with it zeroed.  Add the cooked part first, then add plain water to make the weight equal to the meat weight.  I look at the water and ingredients as a single unit (the brine), and make it equal to the meat weight.  I'm not sure if this is actually how to do it, but it doesn't really matter - as long as you do it the same way, every time.  This is what makes the consistency.

As far as the 10, 15 or 30% cure question - that one's for the ham and sausage makers.  I assume the amount of #1, figured in the calculator, is enough to cure the meat.  I guess I didn't know their are different "degrees" of cure.  Please educate me, if you know.

 

[pignout013]

Sorry i was in a hurry last post and didnt review before posting so I was very vague. I saw in some ones post they talked about injecting to prevent bone sour in large cuts of meat (Ham).  The % of cure #1 added to the brine would have to be much higher in a 7% pump then a 30% pump to get to the approx 200ppm nitrite in ham. The % of pump is figured off of green weight so a 7% pump would have way more cure #1 then a 30% pump . In a 20lb ham at 7% pump you would inject 1.4 lbs brine into ham, at 30% pump you would inject 6lbs brine. all the brine in martins calculator show the same 6.25%cure  7% pump would contain .0875 lb of nitrite in a 20lb ham and 30% pump would have .5 lbs nitrite in the same 20lb ham. I hope im making sence because this confusses the hell out of me also.  (#1) Sorry im not the shapest tool in the shed when it comes to this figuring stuff. LMAO at myself!!! Thanks again for any help and if I sound like a hater or trouble make im not and refer to #1 Kevin

 

[DivotMaker]

OK, Kevin, I think I see what you're talking about.  Hopefully, Martin or Brian (Pork Belly) will chime in on this one.  My take is that, since you are wet brining (meat submersed in liquid), with an equilibrium brine, the percentage of nitrites doesn't matter; the entire solution will equalize.  In large cuts, like a ham, you would inject the same brine into the meat, especially around the bone.  Given a long enough brine time, the solution will eventually reach equilibrium throughout the meat.  Make sense?

From my rudimentary understanding of ham making, I believe you are referring to injecting brine, but not submersing the whole piece in solution, right?  These are two different animals, that essentially achieve the same results.  The difference being, is that the equilibrium brine will be repeatable, very predictably.

As far as the 6.25% calculation - that is the percentage of nitrite in the #1 curing salt, not the desired percentage.  If you inject the solution, with the amount of #1 from the calculator, the ham will get cured all the way through.

Someone please correct me if my assumptions are wrong!

 

[pignout013]

Thanks DM, Ya I know 6.25 is the % nitrite in cure #1 and not sure why I used that specific #. I think I have the way to say this so all can understand. I think we all can agree the reason you pump is to speed up the curing process and to keep from get sour bone because the brine will not soak through the outside to the bone before it starts to spoil at the bone. Now this would be easy if a person had a vacuum tumbler like the big boys but most of us don't. So lets say you use the martin method  Meat weight  9060 g
                                      Nitrite          6.25%                                =28.99
                                        Salt              2%                                    =154.02
                                      Sugar            1%                                    = 90.6
    (sausage 156ppm)        Nitrite          200ppm      = total    wt          9333.61
Now sence we agree that if we dont pump there is a very good chance of bone sour.
So i pickle the leg in this brine above and all of the meat being reach with brine from outside will have 156 ppm but now we take 7% of ham green wt and inject 634 g(7%) in to the leg 2.03 g nitrite, but if i inject with a 20% pump, inject 1812g brine into the leg 5.79 g nitrite. I hope with this written like this you understand my point. I think digging dog may understand what im saying. Thanks again hopefully this will lead to all of us learning something. Its beddy by time. Going fishing for spring Chinook in the morn. Have a good evening KD

 

[DivotMaker]

KD, you have officially exceeded my knowledge level on ham curing. :-[  I'm confident Martin will shed some light on this for you.  I hope to learn something, too!

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

There's some confusion of methods here, there's no percent pump or pick-up in an equilibrium brine.
Meat and water weight don't need to be equal.
It's good to keep the water weight at 25-30% of the meat weight so the brine is of adequate concentration to inhibit spoilage.

Having said that, I prefer to combination cure a whole ham. Dry cure on the outside and a very concentrated brine injected near the bone.

HTH

 

[DivotMaker]

Thanks Martin!  I knew you'd shed a little light on this. 

One question - you say meat and water weight don't need to be equal.  Is that for the combination method you are talking about, or for an equilibrium brine?  If it's for the EQ brine, you have me confused!  From all of the research I've done, the whole point of an EQ brine is to have the meat and brine weight the same, so they act as one unit; is this not the case?  Teach me, "Oh Wise One in the ways of The Brine!"

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

You need the sum of the meat and water weight, but the meat and water weight don't need to be the same.
In other words, meat and water need not weigh 500 grams each, total 1000 grams. 750 grams of meat and 250 grams of water is fine.

HTH

 

[DivotMaker]

So, Martin, as long as the concentration of salt/sugar/cure are correct, you can use a stronger (less water) brine, and get the same results?  Very interesting, indeed!

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

Yes.

 

[DivotMaker]

Yes.

You may sometimes be a man of few words, but you speak volumes!  Thanks, Martin!

 

[cogGrease]

Great discussion, and thanks everyone. I learned a ton, cheers!

 

[DivotMaker]

Thanks Bill!  Studying this opened up a whole new world of brining for me.  Especially for things like jerky, where you want very predictable results, the equilibrium brine absolutely rocks!

 

[cogGrease]

Absolutely,  happy weekend my friend.