Unexpected problem with smoking boneless prime rib

[SmokinSusie-Q]

I have smoked 3 previous prime rib roasts without incident. The one I smoked 2 days ago was the biggest yet (6.35 lb) so I expected it to take approximately 3 hrs.  I placed it in the smoker at 3:05 pm set at 200 degrees with an internal temp. of 122 degrees, as my guests like it pretty rare. I was going to reverse sear it on my grill after smoking.  At 5:00, the internal temp. was 114 degrees.  My guests showed up at 5:30, and I realized the smoker had gone off.  I'm guessing it actually went off at 5:15.  I checked the temp. of the roast, and it registered 146 degrees.  It looked great but it was not medium rare, obviously.  I didn't sear it but let it rest about 10 minutes while I hurried to get the sides ready.  My guests said it was the best rib roast they'd ever had.  So, did the temp. go up because I didn't remove it from the smoker immediately when it was done?  I used  3 3/8 oz. combination of cherry and hickory, cut in 3 pieces, and the smoke flavor was great.  Checking the remains the next day, 3/4 were ash and 1/4 resembled a very small lump of charcoal.  There was lots of grease in the smoker, more than with anything else I've smoked.  Maybe I didn't trim the fat enough?  Previously, my smallest rib roast weighed 4.25 lb and was done in 3 hrs.  Next time, I will certainly keep a closer watch on the smoker! 

Sorry, I have no picture of the finished roast.  I was too busy trying to get everything ready and be with my guests.

 

[Grampy]

Sue, I would say yes the additional time in the smoker carried the temp up. These smokers are so well insulated that just because the heat is shut off does not stop the cooking process. These smokers will hold heat for a long time after it is shut of unless the door is opened to allow it to cool off.

 

[NDKoze]

Sue, I would say yes the additional time in the smoker carried the temp up. These smokers are so well insulated that just because the heat is shut off does not stop the cooking process. These smokers will hold heat for a long time after it is shut of unless the door is opened to allow it to cool off.

+1

Plus, it is pretty welled documented here (most commonly with smaller Boston Butts) larger cuts of meat smoke faster than smaller cuts. I have a feeling that that plus the carryover temp is what took your temp up so high.

 

[SuperDave]

The math doesn't add up in my head.  24 degree carry over in a 200 degree smoker in just 15 minutes isn't plausible. 

 

[NDKoze]

Sue was "guessing" that it turned off at 5:15. My guess is that with the large roast in there it cooked way faster than normal and turned off well prior to 5:15 and spent a lot longer in the smoker that was very slowly going down from 200 degrees.

But, your point is well taken. 24 degrees is quite a bit off of the set temperature. This is the only explanation that I can think of.

 

[SmokinSusie-Q]

Sue was "guessing" that it turned off at 5:15. My guess is that with the large roast in there it cooked way faster than normal and turned off well prior to 5:15 and spent a lot longer in the smoker that was very slowly going down from 200 degrees.

But, your point is well taken. 24 degrees is quite a bit off of the set temperature. This is the only explanation that I can think of.

Many thanks Jimmy, Dave, and Gregg for your feedback.  Thanking about the 24 degree temp. increase, I forgot to mention a possible explanation.  When I discovered that the smoker was beeping, I did not measure the temp. of the roast immediately because I couldn't find a thermometer that worked.  In fact, my husband had to find and replace batteries in one before I could check the internal temp. of the roast.  And during this time, my guests arrived, so my husband had to greet them while I tried to figure out what to do.  I  attempted to restart the program several times to determine what the last readings were but it would not restart.  It would cut itself off and beep, only displaying the "end" reading.  I'm not sure how long all this took.  I obviously was not doing a very good job of dealing with things not going as planned!

 

[SuperDave]

Sue was "guessing" that it turned off at 5:15. My guess is that with the large roast in there it cooked way faster than normal and turned off well prior to 5:15 and spent a lot longer in the smoker that was very slowly going down from 200 degrees.

But, your point is well taken. 24 degrees is quite a bit off of the set temperature. This is the only explanation that I can think of.

She says that the roast was 114 at 5:00.  That would be a 32 degree rise in 30 minutes.  All sounds very weird.

 

[Durangosmoker]

The fact that most of her wood had been reduced to ash makes me think that there was combustion going on in there. That could have helped to raise the temperature in the box.

 

[SmokinSusie-Q]

The fact that most of her wood had been reduced to ash makes me think that there was combustion going on in there. That could have helped to raise the temperature in the box.

How would I know if it was combustion?  And what could I have done to prevent it?

 

[SconnieQ]

You just have to remove the meat when the internal temperature reaches your desired temp...period. Don't rely on a program to shut off automatically and HOLD your meat. The D models do not create any "magic" when it comes to this with their programmability. The smoker will shut off, but the box temp will not cool down, continuing to cook the meat at almost full blast for quite some time. Thus, overcooking your meat. If you want to use the smoker to "hold", you still have to shut off, open the door, and cool down, then put the meat back in at a lower temp. I don't find the programming of the D models particularly useful in general, except for a few things...keeping very accurate temps while cooking, increasing the temperature range, and programming ramping up. As far as shut off or hold, I think the programmability is in fact a detriment, that is going to cause a lot of overcooked meat, but please, someone correct me if I am wrong. If you want your final internal temp to be 122 and try to "program" it to shut off and hold, then you would also have to somehow calculate at what internal temp to set the smoker to shut off based on your set temp of 200 (maybe shut off at IT of 95??? 105???, and what time...how many minutes will your smoker take to cool down??? hold for how long??? to end up at 122 IT at exactly when your guests arrive??). You'd need to be a PhD in Thermodynamics to figure this one out. I don't see any getting around just removing your meat when the IT is what you want...manually.

 

[SmokinSusie-Q]

You just have to remove the meat when the internal temperature reaches your desired temp...period. Don't rely on a program to shut off automatically and HOLD your meat. The D models do not create any "magic" when it comes to this with their programmability. The smoker will shut off, but the box temp will not cool down, continuing to cook the meat at almost full blast for quite some time. Thus, overcooking your meat. If you want to use the smoker to "hold", you still have to shut off, open the door, and cool down, then put the meat back in at a lower temp. I don't find the programming of the D models particularly useful in general, except for a few things...keeping very accurate temps while cooking, increasing the temperature range, and programming ramping up. As far as shut off or hold, I think the programmability is in fact be a detriment, that is going to cause a lot of overcooked meat, but please, someone correct me if I am wrong. If you want your final internal temp to be 122 and try to "program" it to shut off and hold, then you would also have to somehow calculate at what internal temp to set the smoker to shut off based on your set temp of 200 (maybe shut off at IT of 95??? 105???, and what time...how many minutes will your smoker take to cool down??? hold for how long??? to end up at 122 IT at exactly when your guests arrive??). You'd need to be a PhD in Thermodynamics to figure this one out. I don't see any getting around just removing your meat when the IT is what you want...manually.

I have never intended to employ a "hold" when smoking with the 2D.  Unfortunately, I have falsely believed that I would always be in sight when the  internal temp. is reached.  Plus, I was so sure that it would take a least 3 hrs. that I wasn't paying enough attention.  The saying, "Never assume" certainly applies to me!

 

[SconnieQ]

You just have to remove the meat when the internal temperature reaches your desired temp...period. Don't rely on a program to shut off automatically and HOLD your meat. The D models do not create any "magic" when it comes to this with their programmability. The smoker will shut off, but the box temp will not cool down, continuing to cook the meat at almost full blast for quite some time. Thus, overcooking your meat. If you want to use the smoker to "hold", you still have to shut off, open the door, and cool down, then put the meat back in at a lower temp. I don't find the programming of the D models particularly useful in general, except for a few things...keeping very accurate temps while cooking, increasing the temperature range, and programming ramping up. As far as shut off or hold, I think the programmability is in fact be a detriment, that is going to cause a lot of overcooked meat, but please, someone correct me if I am wrong. If you want your final internal temp to be 122 and try to "program" it to shut off and hold, then you would also have to somehow calculate at what internal temp to set the smoker to shut off based on your set temp of 200 (maybe shut off at IT of 95??? 105???, and what time...how many minutes will your smoker take to cool down??? hold for how long??? to end up at 122 IT at exactly when your guests arrive??). You'd need to be a PhD in Thermodynamics to figure this one out. I don't see any getting around just removing your meat when the IT is what you want...manually.

I have never intended to employ a "hold" when smoking with the 2D.  Unfortunately, I have falsely believed that I would always be in sight when the  internal temp. is reached.  Plus, I was so sure that it would take a least 3 hrs. that I wasn't paying enough attention.  The saying, "Never assume" certainly applies to me!

My mom overcooked the Prime Rib one year for Christmas, actually not her fault but long story. It ended up being the best roast beef you've every had! So all was not lost I'm sure. I never really thought about it... but you do have to be "around" with the D models to watch your internal temp. If you use the Maverick, at least you don't have to be right close by. Maybe the next step is wireless capability with the D models. I think even if I had a D model, I'd be sticking a wireless probe in the meat anyway for convenience. Can't wait for that MEATER to come out...

 

[NDKoze]

+1 on waiting for the Meater. I hope it is all that it should be.

My only worry is that the probe seems pretty thick. But, I guess for most meats it shouldn't be a problem.

 

[DivotMaker]

Sue, I had to give this one some thought!  If I read it right, when you saw the internal temp of 114, at 5 pm, the smoker was still on.  Since you only had another 8° to your target temp, my guess is that y'all got busy greeting guests, and that it actually went off later than 5:15...but I may be wrong.  I doubt you would have reached that 8° in 15 minutes.  At any rate, not watching (when getting close) was your downfall.  I suspect it hit 122, and shutoff, as it's supposed to, but you just didn't get back to it before it continued to cook.  These smokers are very tight, and well-insulated, so they hold the box temp for a long time!  You didn't mention what time it was when the temp showed 146°, but I suspect it was much later than 5:15.

Kari, I disagree that the programming is a "detriment;" you just have to know what you are trying to accomplish, and be there to monitor what you are trying to do!  I've said it many times, before, that the programming is a great tool, but it's not total "autopilot!"  Inspect what you expect!

Gregg - just a side note:  The "small cut" crazy timing really doesn't apply to this type of smoke.  Lean beef roasts (other than really small briskets), smoked low and slow at 200°, are actually pretty predictable.  There isn't a stall, and the climb stays pretty consistent. 

Bottom line (for all):  Check on your smoke!  Don't rely on programming, or how long you "think" it should take.  Monitor, and adjust accordingly!  Use a remote thermometer, with WiFi or Bluetooth, if you can't check on it frequently!

Oh, and for those of you waiting on the Meater.... I'll soon be testing a WiFi/Bluetooth/Cloud remote thermometer (with graphing) that I believe is going to be superior to the Meater, and much cheaper....more to follow soon!

 

[SconnieQ]

When I said detriment, I was not referring to the programming feature in general. I make my living in the technology world. So I definitely appreciate the programmability. I was referring specifically to programming the end of the cook, my concern being that just because you have the ability to program the smoker to turn off or switch to a hold temp when your internal temperature is reached, it might create an assumption that you don't have to remove the meat.

Can't wait to hear about your Meater knockoff. I was wondering if it would get copied before it even hit the market.

 

[SconnieQ]

+1 on waiting for the Meater. I hope it is all that it should be.

My only worry is that the probe seems pretty thick. But, I guess for most meats it shouldn't be a problem.

I think the probe will be about 1/4 inch thick, which is pretty darn thick... although recently they made it sound like they might have gotten it a bit slimmer. For brisket or any meat you are going to slice, if you insert the probe from a direction parallel to the direction you will be slicing, you can avoid having a probe hole in every slice! I already use that technique with the Maverick to avoid the smaller hole in every slice.

 

[NDKoze]

Gregg - just a side note:  The "small cut" crazy timing really doesn't apply to this type of smoke.  Lean beef roasts (other than really small briskets), smoked low and slow at 200°, are actually pretty predictable.  There isn't a stall, and the climb stays pretty consistent.

I was totally speculating on this part since I really couldn't understand how it could jump so fast in such a short amount of time. But, I stand corrected. Thanks for that.

Oh, and for those of you waiting on the Meater.... I'll soon be testing a WiFi/Bluetooth/Cloud remote thermometer (with graphing) that I believe is going to be superior to the Meater, and much cheaper....more to follow soon!

I am pretty sure I know which thermometer you are going to be testing (I won't spill the beans), and I remember thinking that there were some pros and cons when compared to "The Meater". Based on what I saw and hoping to see from "The Meater", I still think I like the design/features of "The Meater" better. The one you are looking at looks a bit clunky to me and still has corded probes which I find to be a real pain in the butt and am very much looking forward to getting rid of.

Hopefully the results tell us that both products are really good, and when the pros and cons are compared will come down to a personal preference as to which one people will like better. I am looking forward to hearing your results as well as getting my hands on my Meater Block and providing some test results for mine as well. Exciting times in the world of BBQ!!!

 

[NDKoze]

+1 on waiting for the Meater. I hope it is all that it should be.

My only worry is that the probe seems pretty thick. But, I guess for most meats it shouldn't be a problem.

I think the probe will be about 1/4 inch thick, which is pretty darn thick... although recently they made it sound like they might have gotten it a bit slimmer. For brisket or any meat you are going to slice, if you insert the probe from a direction parallel to the direction you will be slicing, you can avoid having a probe hole in every slice! I already use that technique with the Maverick to avoid the smaller hole in every slice.

Good point Kari! I do the same thing already, so agree that it won't be much of a problem.

I am sorry for kind of taking this thread off topic. It will be cool to have a new comparison thread once these two new thermometers start having some live test results.

<Back to the OP's original topic>

 

[SconnieQ]

I am pretty sure I know which thermometer you are going to be testing (I won't spill the beans), and I remember thinking that there were some pros and cons when compared to "The Meater". Based on what I saw and hoping to see from "The Meater", I still think I like the design/features of "The Meater" better. The one you are looking at looks a bit clunky to me and still has corded probes which I find to be a real pain in the butt and am very much looking forward to getting rid of.

Hopefully the results tell us that both products are really good, and when the pros and cons are compared will come down to a personal preference as to which one people will like better. I am looking forward to hearing your results as well as getting my hands on my Meater Block and providing some test results for mine as well. Exciting times in the world of BBQ!!!

If the mystery thermometer has corded probes, then it's not really comparable to the Meater. The probe without a wire that measures both box temp and internal temp from a single probe is the unique feature that separates it from others. I just assumed the mystery thermometer Tony is testing did not have wired probes, because there are already wifi/cloud thermometers with corded probes and graphing on the market (Tappeque, iCelsius, iGrill, etc.). iGrill was sold to Weber so I wonder if the mystery thermometer has something to do with that...sorry, off topic too.

 

[SmokinSusie-Q]

Sue, I had to give this one some thought!  If I read it right, when you saw the internal temp of 114, at 5 pm, the smoker was still on.  Since you only had another 8° to your target temp, my guess is that y'all got busy greeting guests, and that it actually went off later than 5:15...but I may be wrong.  I doubt you would have reached that 8° in 15 minutes.  At any rate, not watching (when getting close) was your downfall.  I suspect it hit 122, and shutoff, as it's supposed to, but you just didn't get back to it before it continued to cook.  These smokers are very tight, and well-insulated, so they hold the box temp for a long time!  You didn't mention what time it was when the temp showed 146°, but I suspect it was much later than 5:15.

Kari, I disagree that the programming is a "detriment;" you just have to know what you are trying to accomplish, and be there to monitor what you are trying to do!  I've said it many times, before, that the programming is a great tool, but it's not total "autopilot!"  Inspect what you expect!

Gregg - just a side note:  The "small cut" crazy timing really doesn't apply to this type of smoke.  Lean beef roasts (other than really small briskets), smoked low and slow at 200°, are actually pretty predictable.  There isn't a stall, and the climb stays pretty consistent. 

Bottom line (for all):  Check on your smoke!  Don't rely on programming, or how long you "think" it should take.  Monitor, and adjust accordingly!  Use a remote thermometer, with WiFi or Bluetooth, if you can't check on it frequently!

Oh, and for those of you waiting on the Meater.... I'll soon be testing a WiFi/Bluetooth/Cloud remote thermometer (with graphing) that I believe is going to be superior to the Meater, and much cheaper....more to follow soon!

I'm positive that the 146 temp. was not reached by 5:15.  I didn't realize the smoker went off until 5:30 when the guests arrived, and it was probably another 10 or 15 minutes before I finally obtained the reading with a battery operated digital thermometer. Thanks to the Forum members, I hope I'll have better results next time.