New Mojoe Griddle- I Need Unbiased Product Review

Camadile

Camadile

New member
Hey Guys:

I have a favor to ask. 

I have been an outdoor cook (mostly backyard & overland camping) for most of my life.  (I just got into smoking over the last year with my Model #2.)  Over the last five years, I have been tinkering with and designing a new portable outdoor cooking griddle that turns conventional wisdom upside-down.

I have since started a new company called Mojoe Outfitters to manufacture and market the "Mojoe Griddle" as well as many other future outdoor products and accessories that buck conventional wisdom.

So here is the favor that I am asking:  I need your brutally honest evaluation and opinions about the Mojoe Griddle and its price.  You can watch several videos of this product in action at my website:  www.mojoeoutfitters.com.

By definition, you Smokin'-it guys are all backyard chefs like myself and I'm sure your all have a lot more outdoor cooking gear and gadgets stashed in your garages.  Therefore, I will respect and listen to whatever you have to say.

Food for thought:  A few months ago, I had a party with 30 guests in my backyard.  I smoked a whole brisket in the #2, pulled it and used the Mojoe Griddle on top of a deep fat turkey fryer burner to make smoked brisket tacos for everyone.  I fried the brisket with onions and pineapple chunks to make an amazing taco filling while at the same time cooking all the tortillas.

I really appreciate any backyard pro input that you folks can give me.  Also, let me know if this is an inappropriate use of this forum.

Thanks,

Cam Stone
 
Cam,

You're not spamming us - you're actually a Smokin-It owner, and are introducing us to your own product.  I, personally, have no problem with that.  If others feel differently, I'm sure they'll let me know.

I checked out the site.  Nice site, and unique product.  With that said, I think the price is out of line.  You'll probably sell a bunch of these to folks in California, and maybe Colorado, (no offense meant to anyone from those states, it's just a cost of living issue.  They're used to paying lots more for things than the rest of the country), but you may have a hard time in "middle America."  I'm originally from California, and lived in Colorado, so I understand how many affluent live in those states.  That may be your target demographic; I don't know.

Although unique, it's just a 24" piece of 1/4" plate steel, some nicely-designed handles, and some bent rod for legs.  My local welding shop could throw me one of those together pretty cheap.  Don't take it the wrong way; you deserve to make a decent profit on a unique item, and I have no idea what your production costs are.  My point deals with perceived value.  If you're going to sell something for $250, you'd better have $250 or more perceived value in the item.  You asked for brutal honesty - I just don't see that here.  I'm all about cool Q tools, but don't see myself buying one of these at your price.
 
Hello Cam,

I watched your videos - all of them - and I think you have a good product. Who doesn't need a griddle once in a while? In my scouting days in the early 60's we used dutch oven lids, Coleman griddles on the old stove, but yours has legs and handles which I like.  However, like DivotMaker stated, I too would have a tough time parting with that much money.

I realize that time and material went into development, and that there is a crowd that will probably jump on this, but there is also likely to be a group that will take your work and duplicate it at a local welding shop for much less.  They will do so not because they are industrious but because your price trumped their laziness.

I do like the product and the fact it is American made. However, the cost is steep. It apparently performs its tasks admirably.  The cost factor may be its hindrance to success.  Legs?  Great! No balancing on rocks.  Removable handles? Another plus. The cleats to fit a Weber and prevent sliding?  Ingenious.  But the price?

I would rethink the $, and the market you are trying to reach.

But don't get discouraged. I do like the concept and the features.

Dave
 
Tony & Dave:

I really, really appreciate the time you took to watch the videos and write down your comments.  Thank you so much!  I suspected that price might be an issue because I've only sold about 20 units so far, but nobody out there except for you two have told me that, and I respect your opinions.

You are right- the idea is so simple there is definitely the "why didn't I think of that" factor going on.  And yes, If you wanted to have your local welder make the griddle with mounting bars minus the handles, he would probably do that for a little less than $200 if he can find the circle blank.  The handles are a different story but I won't go into that now.  The bottom line is that what pops into your head is: "I can make that myself" and that is an issue that I need to deal with.

I have already spent $5,000 to secure a provisional patent on the Mojoe Griddle and I am in the process of spending an additional $15,000 for the formal patent application.  Developing, producing and marketing a new US made product in the US is extremely expensive.  I could have gone to China for a lot less money but that's not how I roll.  All of this is meaningless, of course, because perception is everything.

All that said, I have another question: At what price would you at least think about buying a Mojoe Griddle.  I not talking about actually buying one but just thinking about buying one?

Cam
 
Due to its simplicity, anyone who is proficient or has a friend proficient @ welding will copy your idea.  If your price point drops to a figure that most find reasonable there is still shipping to wrestle with.  The weight of your product will have steep S&H.  A reoccuring theme amongst potential Smokin-It buyers, especially the SI#3, choke when they find out the shipping costs.  Some fortunate to live relatively close bypass this by picking it up, some get over it and eventually purchase after reassurances from the forum, some purchase smaller units to compensate.  However, the key to that always goes back to the total cost as compared to similar options in the market, i.e. ST or Cookshack in this case.  What you have designed WILL definately have a niche market.  The quality looks very good.  Where I would start, is to look for anything else out there that performs a similar function.  I happen to have a griddle in a commercial style oven, so it would be unlikely for me to acquire another even though its for outdoor use.  Some may rely on their dutch oven lids like Dave mentioned.  Granted, these are 2 extreme examples & you wont be directly competing with them but they will factor in on potential sales.  Something closer to your idea should be examined. Compare price, quality, function & where its made.  The last 3 factors will determine if a premium or discount should be charged.  I am not afraid to pay a premium on things I want & am fortunate to be able to do so.  But...... I research my purchases & only do so if it makes good sense for me. What you have going for you is the promise of a well thought out product that will allow a portable outdoor cooking experience with the vistas of your choice!  It's a foodie lifestyle your selling.  I hope you find success in this adventure.
 
Thanks for your insights Walt,

You guys have convinced me that I will need to reduce my price and believe me, I spend a lot of time on cost reduction.  My target buyer is in the upper end of the various markets that I am going after.  I have spent a great deal of time searching the portable griddle competition on the internet and have found that nothing else out there comes anywhere close to the versatility, ruggedness and cooking surface size.  There has to be a premium for that so I am definitely not expecting the average Joe camper or backyard BBQ guy to buy one.  They will get their griddles from China.

BTW: My target markets are at the upper end of:

- Overland 4x4 adventurers
- Large group car campers
- RV-ers
- Tailgaters
- Survivalists
- Caterers (outdoor parties)
- Serious backyard cooks

Also, I paid $70 to get my Model 2 shipped here because it was worth it.  When I saw the shipping price, I did pause for a minute or two though!

Thanks again, Walt, for your input!

Cam


 
Cam,

You obviously have a great deal invested in the success of this endeavor.  I agree with Walt that you will definitely have a niche market, as I alluded to in my post.  After thinking about this some more, I wanted to add a couple more thoughts...

First, the cost of shipping will be a factor for many, due to size and weight.  Yes, the cost to ship SI smokers seems hefty, but you're paying for protection and speed.  These are big boxes, very-well packed, and contain fragile components (nobody wants a dent in their stainless skin).  Your grill couldn't hardly get damaged no matter how it was shipped, so the cost is solely based on size and weight.  I didn't explore shipping costs, so this is just a thought about the subject based on guesstimates.  Like you said, it's perceptions.

I would maybe consider different size options.  I consider myself a "serious backyard cook," but don't buy products that don't fit my needs.  Yes, it would be cool to have a Model 4 SI (for bragging rights alone), and I'm fortunate to have the means to have one, but it simply does not fit my needs.  I would not want to deal with deployment and storage of a hunk of steel that large.  If you had, say, a 16" or 18" model, I could possibly see myself interested.  So, my lack of interest in the product is not based solely on cost; it's more about need.  With that said, I believe there are many others, in the target markets you mentioned, that would be well-suited with a grill that large.  It would also add different price points to the equation.

About the "Made in America" issue:  I absolutely applaud your desire to have your product produced here!  At the same time, I understand business owners' decisions to produce their products offshore.  We live in a very competitive global marketplace, and, sadly, America has a hard time competing.  SI smokers are built in China.  While I would prefer they were made in the USA, I fully understand Steve's predicament.  Is the quality any less?  I don't think so.  Mine is well-built, and works great.  I am sure that producing the SI in the US would probably double its price, and push it into the Cookshack price range.  Would I buy one at twice what I paid?  A solid "maybe."  There are definitely other offshore options than China.  South Korea (actually Hyundai) is one of the largest steel producers in the world, is an ally of the US, and a free nation.  Who knows, that may be worth exploring.  I personally don't think your customers really care where the product is produced, as long as the quality is what it needs to be, and it functions "as advertised."  Unfortunately, we (as a Nation) have priced ourselves out of the manufacturing markets due to so many reasons I won't bother to get into.  Here's an example - about 10 years ago, a large highway bridge was built in Arkansas.  All of the massive I-beams were marked "Hyundai" on them!  It was actually cheaper to have them manufactured in S. Korea, ship them here on Hyundai container ships, and trucked to Arkansas, than it was to have them produced in Pittsburgh!  Sad, but true.

You mentioned, you could have gone offshore, but that's "not how I roll."  Unless you find a manufacturer who is going to be competitive with other countries, I would urge you to reconsider your position.  Until your patents are secure, you can bet that a competitor or two is already figuring-out how they can reproduce your grill cheaper.  In the end, buyers will turn to the cheaper competitor.  Research manufacturing in free countries that are strong allies of the US.  You don't have to go to China.  Hold on - my steel fabricator buddy is calling.  Be right back... (just kidding! ;) )

I wish you the best success, Cam!  Many folks, who have never attempted to start a business, don't know what you are going through right now.  Keep the faith, stay strong, and above all - make sound business decisions without emotion. 
 
Cam,
Have you thought about going to Kickstarter with this? I agree with most on the pricing but I do understand that your demographic might be in the upper range, period. And you can make a decent profit from those people. But if you wish to maybe make it more mainstream then you might want to do something in a smaller range to alleviate some of the costs but still end up with a better product than some competitors that will come out. I have backed a lot of projects on Kickstarter that have failed and succeeded and learned a lot from that based on their feedback.
You have a unique product for some and for others something that could be made with some effort. Don't dwell on that much since there will always be those of us out there that have the resources to mimic products through friends and family.
I wish you the best of luck on it and keep trucking along. You will do well with it overall. 
 
Great recommendation, Ben!  I know a little about Kickstarter, but not much.  I'm going to look into it! 

You're absolutely right about him profiting from the upper-end market, but why limit it to that?  This is a viable product across a much larger demographic.  One of the biggest detriments to new start-ups is placing limits on what they think they can do.  Go for a larger demographic, and let sales and interest drive where you end up.  The market will define itself over time, but cannot be "predetermined." 

Another rule I've lived is that people will pay more than you think they will.  I think Cam is seeing that his current pricing is not producing the sales he is expecting, at least with his current advertising.  But, if he lowers it too much, he may be leaving money on the table.  One way to narrow-down pricing is to test different prices through different sources of advertising.  It's proven that there is an optimum price for everything; too low, and people will think it's a scam.  Too high, and people immediately retreat.  The right price, with the right value built into the product, will produce the most sales.  I think Cam's website builds value, but needs some more "in use" videos to build more.  He needs some good shots of an expedition cooking a big meal on it at the end of the day, or a bunch of RVers gathered around it, smiling and happy at the smell of the food.  Sell the sizzle, not the steak.
 
I had some down time (goofing off again) so I prowled around looking at pricing for carbon steel plate at 1/4 inch.  I could not locate round discs, just flat stock in both cold rolled and hot rolled. A square 2' X 2', sheared to size ran in the high $40's to the low $70's, depending upon supplier.  When the sizing was done by plasma or CNC Laser, the cost went up considerably. I can only guess that producing a round with no burrs would be pricey. And adding the legs and handles, and cleats, I reckon Cam is in the ball park.  It is a nice product, good features, but it has to be viewed more as a necessary specially item rather than a simple addition to our outdoor/back yard cooking equipment.

If I had a cabin in the woods off the grid, real rustic, oil lamps and such, this would be a good item to have for a variety of reasons.  There are pros and cons with all products for open fire cooking.  I am or was used to the cast iron skillets  balanced on coals and rocks method;  ideal for 1 or 2.  For several folks, repetitive cooking till all are served.  This sort of solves the 'why can't we all eat at the same time" problem.  I can see it being used like a stove top with pots and pans as cooking vessels when it is not needed as a griddle.

It is a niche product. Nothing wrong with that.  And I truly do like it.  I guess it boils down to lifestyle and pastimes and budget. But for my limited use, I will stick with my old Lodge grill/griddle at approximately $50.  It is lacking in the features of the MoJoe, but for me it works.
 
That's it, in a nutshell, Dave!  "Why do I NEED this product over what I have now?"  If Cam can crack that nut, he'll have a winner, for sure!
 
Exactly you guys. This is something that fills a need for SOME people but mostly not everyone. Smaller size. Maybe. But still something that might not get to the same point of "Why not just use a Lodge cast iron skillet or whatever"
 
Thus why I would suggest a Kickstarter campaign to HELP him get to a bigger audience. Plus they will fund him getting more R&D done to hone the final product and help to secure a better foundry that could cut costs.
 
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