Opening the door?

[SuperDave]

I read a lot of posts about not opening the door.  How you all smoke a variety of dishes at the same time without opening the door?  One of the things that was appealing to me with these smokers was the number of racks and all the different things that I could cram into one of these things.  A typical cook for me will involve a handful of door openings EVERY time.  Am I wasting my money on one of these smokers? 

 

[swthorpe]

Ideally, you want to put the meat in the smoker, set the temp, and let it go until the meat is done (usually by reaching a desired IT).  However, there are times when you might need to open the door, you just don't want to be doing it too often.  I would also recommend not opening the door for at the least the first heating cycle when the wood could catch fire with the rush of oxygen.  After the first hour, if you need to open the door, be a quick as possible!  The unit recovers quickly to the desired heat setting, but the longer the door is open, the more heat you lose.

When I do BB ribs, for example, I leave the door closed for the first 4-4.5 hours.  I then open the door to remove and add BBQ sauce to the ribs, and then put them back in for another hour or so.  What I try to do is plan opening the door when my #2 is at the maximum temperature swing, so while I will lose some heat, the unit will stay close to where I want the temp.  For ribs, I set at 225-230, but with the temperature swings of +/-15F, I would wait until the temp was at the higher end (say 245F), and then open the door.  By the time I get the ribs out and the door shut, the temp might drop to say 210F, but the then the unit will start heating again to bring the temp back up.

In all of the smokes that I have done, I can't think of any where I needed to open the door more than two-three times for the duration.  So again, I recommend only opening the door if it is necessary...avoid peeking where possible!

 

[DivotMaker]

Dave, you sound like a person who wants to cook a lot of different items at one time, in the same smoker.  Many folks smoke meat, with some side items (maybe potatoes and/or beans), with success.  It's not to say you should NEVER open the door during a smoke, but I believe it to be detrimental to the cooking process. 
You also sound like someone who isn't happy unless you are constantly involved in the cooking process, and tending to every minute of it (I gather from your comments about how you get wood smoking).

With that being said, this may not be the smoker you are looking for.  If you love to constantly tend and tinker, open, prod, check, re-arrange, etc..., you will not be happy with an SI smoker.  Now, if you embrace the concept that you can have a smoker that will make some of the best BBQ you've ever had, and it'll do it with the least intervention from you, than this smoker is for you.  Personally, I let my smoker handle the meat, and sides go in the oven, grill, or stove. 

There is no wrong answer, but if you are planning on using the SI smoker like you said in your post, you likely won't be happy.

 

[SuperDave]

With my #4, I'm thinking a couple pork butts, ribs, beans and mac & cheese at the same time.  How many times do I open the door?  It the biggest concern is how much time is added to the ultimate cook time, this is a non issue for me.  But if it is something more, let's keep talking about it. 

 

[swthorpe]

I assume you will put everything in at the same time to get full smoke on all items.  If this is the case, then the mac/cheese and beans could be removed at about 3 hours (1 open), and the ribs would be removed at 5-5.5 hours (second open), unless you want to do what I do in removing the ribs at 4-4.5 hours for a saucing, then back in for another hour (1 more open to remove, then another to put back).  The butts would stay on for several more hours and no need to open the door until you get the desired IT.    The openings should not add much time at all to your smoke.  For your example, the m/c and beans need 3 hours, the ribs 5.5 hours, and the butts could go as long as 10+ hours depending on size (figure 2hrs per pound, conservatively).  If all of this is planned for one meal, then you will have your hands full trying to keep the m/c, beans and ribs warm while the butts finish!

 

[DivotMaker]

OK, Dave, it's more in context now.  Let's break this down by length of smoke.  The butts, obviously, will take the longest (10-? hours, depending on size).  I personally smoke butts at 225, but that's just my choice.  The ribs will be 5-6 hours, if you use 225-235.  The mac & cheese and beans are pretty flexible.  So, If you start them all together, you would open around the 4.5 hour point to check the ribs, and probably remove the side items.  Then, close back up and don't open again until the ribs are done (maybe around 5:30?).  Last door opening will be when the butts are done.  Essentially 3 openings, which shouldn't be a big deal.  Ideal scenario is not to open at all, but this is not set in stone, by any means! 

 

[SuperDave]

Tony, being that your points of reference are from a #1 and a #2, do you think that is a direct carry over to a #4?

Also, I'm a pull and wrap guy so I'll have to work that into my new method of smoking. 

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

I have a #4.
Opening the door isn't a big deal if you're sensible about it! 
If the smoker isn't coming back up to temp as quickly as you'd like (low load or in the dead of winter or whatever) add some thermal storage the bottom rack.
I bought eight 7 pound 6061 aluminum bricks...they work great!  ;D

 

[SuperDave]

I've been smoking long enough to know that there is no perfect smoker and no two people will smoke in exactly the same way.  I've very excited about the volume available in the #4.  I'm also pretty sure I'll find a way to make it work for me.  Thanks for the open dialogue. 

 

[DivotMaker]

Dave, yes, the reference from the #1 and 2 will definitely carry-over to a 3 or 4.  The basics of these smokers is the same; the only difference is interior volume.  But, each model has a larger element, so time to heat and time to recover from a door opening will be pretty much the same.

 

[NDKoze]

To be clear, I think the main issue with opening the door is the loss of moisture when you open the door. The units come back up to temp really fast. So, I don't think opening the door is really going to add much if any time to your smokes.

To each his own on the foiling, but you will find that the vast majority here do not waste their foil by wrapping their meat. It just isn't needed with these smokers. I would strongly encourage you to try skipping the foil if/when you pull the trigger on your #4.

 

[SuperDave]

For the vast majority of you that don't foil, are you saving your juices another way?  When I do pork butt or brisket, I foil in a pan and get my au jus. 

 

[NDKoze]

I haven't ever saved the juice, but there is usually plenty of juice/fat drippings that accumulate in the built-in drip pan that you should be able to use. I brine all of my butts and with all the juice that is lost, I have never had a dry one either.

I would be interested to hear how you prepare the Au Jus and how you use it. That sounds like something I would like to try.

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

I catch juices in a pan, I can't bare to throw away all that flavor.  8)

 

[Pork Belly]

I wouldn't put a catch pan in the smoker that is proven to cause issues.

 

[NDKoze]

I wouldn't put a catch pan in the smoker that is proven to cause issues.

The only way I would put a catch pan "in" the smoker would be if it was on the floor of the smoker. You could put some loaf pans on either side of the smoke box. This is typically where I put my mini-loaf pan filled with Apple Cider or Beer. But you could put some empty catch pans next to the smoke box. I still would just use the built-in catch pan though.

The catch pans on the shelves below the meat are big no-no's and will cause temp fluctuations and problems with your smoker getting to the desired temp.

But, like I wrote above, there are ways to work around this.

 

[DiggingDogFarm]

I wouldn't put a catch pan in the smoker that is proven to cause issues.

Not a problem if it's kept well clear of the temperature sensor.
A pan or whatever funneling heat over the sensor is what causes the problems.

 

[SuperDave]

There are some meats that I smoke directly in a pan.  This is going to be quite a ride! 

 

[NDKoze]

I'm always looking for new ideas. While some traditional smoking techniques do not work well with electric smokers, others do.

It sounds like you are an experienced smoker Dave. So, I am looking forward to see what kind of smokes you're going to try.

 

[DivotMaker]

Dave, you're encountering the hardest part of converting from a "traditional" smoker to one of these - breaking old habits.  Many of the techniques you are used to are intended to counter the effects of a charcoal or stick burner (namely moisture loss).  Those smokers are a much drier environment, and all the foiling/mopping/spritzing/putting in pans, etc. is to keep the meat more moist.  What you'll find, with these smokers, is is just isn't necessary.  With most smokes, there is not need for au jus because the meat is already so dang moist!  I don't think there would be any problem using something like a mini-loaf pan, on a shelf close below the meat, but I wouldn't go any larger.  Drip pans between the smoke box and the meat have proven problematic, and are just best avoided.

Embrace the world of Lazy Q, and your old smokers will get lonely! 8)