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Author Topic: Auber PID  (Read 674 times)

Polish Q

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Auber PID
« on: December 12, 2013, 09:42:10 PM »
I used the Auber but didn't bypass anything. I simply plugged in SI3 power to the PID and it's respective power cord to outlet.  Set program of PID to 225 and walked away with the Si3 dial itself to 250. Obviously PID regulated to the 225 but I would say it went for 223 to 231 ... Not sure that's wildly tight in its control.

Anyone have instructions on how to bypass then SI3 controller? I have read of this and not sure why one need to do that with this PID ... Does it give better resolution if one does this?
Brinkmann '07... Offset '11... Smokin-It '13!!!

DivotMaker

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2013, 09:57:04 PM »
Good discussion on the Auber here:

http://smokinitforums.com/index.php?topic=1041.0

Might want to jump into this thread, rather than starting a new one.

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Tony from NW Arkansas

Polish Q

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #2 on: December 13, 2013, 07:15:22 PM »
Thanks. So I think this particular link to the forum helped. I read a few others but they didn't actually get to the point I was looking for.

It appears one only need bypass the controller if they want higher temps. THAT SAID, I now have one (or actually two) questions…

1. Do you get tighter temperature control if  you bypass the SI3 controller on the unit (seems like the answer would be no).

2. MOST IMPORTANTLY… since the AUBER is calibrated for another electric unit (I believe a Weber or something) has anyone ever auto-tuned their AUBER per the instructions to update  the PID settings for yet event tighter control?

Seems in most cases the SI3 w/out a PID holds the temp swings to +/-7 deg F based on some other factors… and my auber trial run the other day where I destroyed the food (I'm learning… I don't think it has anything to do with the product)… seemed to hold it +/- 4 deg F… that doesn't seem like a GREAT benefit for the $200 for the AUBER… so I'm just wondering if running the auto tune helps…

THANKS if ANYONE KNOWS… not complaining… just trying to learn and learn from all of your experience….
Brinkmann '07... Offset '11... Smokin-It '13!!!

Wik

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #3 on: December 13, 2013, 11:19:00 PM »
I was wondering the same thing.  I'm assuming you would want to auto-tune it with normal load, meaning full of meat or similar mass.  Granted I haven't used mine yet with the #3 smoker and I'm not sure how tight of a swing is really necessary as I bought it more for the ability to cook then hold at warming temp without me standing over it.  I might use it tomorrow to see how close it stays while smoking some ribs and a meatloaf.  I'll try and report the type of swings I have unless too cold to leave the PID outside (don't want to break the new toy with sub zero wintertime temps).

Heck - If decent enough maybe I'll try the auto-tune option.  If memory serves me right it doesn't take all that long for it to hone in on it / finish the auto-tuning if it works like my Auber PID I use for brewing beer.  If I get to this I'll report back the settings it calibrated itself with.  I'm sure there are lotz of variables, but I am curious to see just how close the preset values are to a real life auto-tuned values.

Cheers,
Wik
« Last Edit: December 13, 2013, 11:34:17 PM by Wik »
Chad from Moorhead, MN
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benjammn

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #4 on: December 14, 2013, 03:34:34 AM »
Actually with a PID controller you WILL have more consistent temps in the unit. As long as you hook it up correctly.

The PID will calibrate to your particular unit if you bring temps up to the desired level and choose the AutoTune function. It will learn how to control the temps over a short period of time. Then you will only have to set you desired temp and it will bring the unit up to that point and hold it there. Approximately within a few degrees. This will help to decrease the actual cooking times since it is a more steady temp for the meat.

Your figures of the SI3 holding within 7 deg is most likely way off, most everyone here sees a swing of ~30deg as the unit heats then shuts off. If your unit truly holds those temps without a PID then you have an almost perfect thermostat. Thus a PID would not really be of any benefit to you. But I doubt that.

PIDs work but turning on/off the element at a higher frequency to try and hold the temp. It is basically a small computer that determines the best algorithm to use to keep things in check.
Ben in Chandler, AZ
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Wik

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #5 on: December 14, 2013, 07:29:59 AM »
The PID will calibrate to your particular unit if you bring temps up to the desired level and choose the AutoTune function.

I agree with you Ben, but I believe you don't want to bring it up to temp prior to hitting the AutoTune.  My understanding is you want to start AutoTune when smoker is cold, so it can learn not to overshot the temp you desire on the initial rise.

I just started this method this morning with 2 ribs in place, smoker temp ~49F to start, outdoor temp ~1F, 225F target temp and sensor 1 on topmost rack with the ribs.  Observations so far:

-AutoTune initial overshot was 243F (I'm sure it will make some adjustments to P value)

-At about ~200 (really rough here as I was snapping a picture) I hear a small Woof, exhale of smoke almost like a small dud explosion you would see on myth busters.  Then smoke again.  Not sure what this was about, maybe the wood starting to burn instead of smoke?  Anyway if that is the case hope that doesn't cause the tuning to "overthink" the overshot temp.

-Lastly I just had to snap a picture while it was at ~240F to show you guys Minnesota style thermo-imaging.

I'll update with my post AutoTuned settings, but would be curious as to the results of others with different variables / factors to see how close they are to mine and how far they are away from initial / default settings.

Edit - Results:
Setting                  Original                 My AutoTuned #3
P                           70                        75
I                            600                      715
d                           150                      89

Had to open after 3 hrs of cooking ribs to throw in a Meatloaf for the kids.  Temp dropped to 150F then after I closed the door it did the following (150F > 225F > 222F> 225F) one iteration before settling back into bouncing between 1F of 225F.  Since this is my first time using PID on smoker not sure how this compares to default settings.  At a certain point here I think I'm splitting hairs.  Time for a beer, yes it is before noon...  Don't judge...   ;D

Cheers,
Wik
« Last Edit: December 14, 2013, 10:26:41 AM by Wik »
Chad from Moorhead, MN
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benjammn

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #6 on: December 14, 2013, 02:39:30 PM »
hey its 5 o'clock somewhere!
Ben in Chandler, AZ
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Polish Q

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #7 on: December 14, 2013, 09:57:39 PM »
Clarification... The 7 deg swings I saw were WITH my Auber and the default settings.

Auto tune in process will report numbers.

NOTE I am going to autotune for various ambient temps. This one will be for 47 deg F. I use my SI3 in attached garage. I have hooked up a dryer vent about 5 feet high on exterior garage wall and then run ducting from the SI3 right to the vent ... About 18 inches... No smoke anywhere in the garage. Perfect because I can always smoke out of elements sunlight etc. I will get a pic at some point. Still just a rookie.
Brinkmann '07... Offset '11... Smokin-It '13!!!

Polish Q

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2013, 10:00:18 PM »
Using auto tune is easy. The instructions are not. :-)
Brinkmann '07... Offset '11... Smokin-It '13!!!

benjammn

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2013, 10:13:40 PM »
That backdraft has happened to me too. It was when the wood I put in was 1)too much 2) too dry and actually caught on fire. It was suffocating and oversaturated the air with fuel, then POOOM! I was outside next to it when it happened. Scared the shit out of me. Hasn't happened since then though.

Sounds like your PID is working like a champ though.
Ben in Chandler, AZ
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Polish Q

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #10 on: December 15, 2013, 12:27:19 AM »
P = 83 (v 70)
I = 909 (v 600)
D = 113 (v 150)

This for a 33 deg F day and garage at 47 degF.
Seemed to take about 90 minutes but probably a bit less.

That was pretty easy.

Now I am wondering if one should basically autotune it with every cook? Given ambient, food, etc. seems this is so easy why not.
Brinkmann '07... Offset '11... Smokin-It '13!!!

bluecatpride

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2013, 11:07:19 PM »
I noticed where someone got the 1240 model for their #2.  Is the way to go or will the #2 accept the 1530 also?  I am new to smoking and want to get the correct thing.

Wik

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Re: Auber PID
« Reply #12 on: December 17, 2013, 09:32:51 PM »
I haven't read completely up on the differences, but even if I had the #2 instead of #3 I'd probably go with the 1503 since it appears to be the same thing just capable of 1800 watts instead of 1450 watts.  Who knows when and if you ever upgrade to something with more wattage requirements.  If there is any other difference, I'm unaware of it but I haven't overly investigated it either.
Cheers,
Wik
Chad from Moorhead, MN
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